---
title: "Five Successful Ventures in a Row: The Secret Is Using Product Thinking for Marketing"
description: "Du Guoying, a name unfamiliar to many post-90s and post-00s but known to post-80s, has created products like Back-Back Jia, Haojixing, E-ren E-ben, 8848, and Xiaoguan Tea. In marketing circles, opinions about him are mixed: some despise him for what they see as 'cutting leeks' (exploiting consumers), while others admire his marketing prowess and secretly learn from him. This article explores whether he is a 'leek master' or a 'product manager', and reveals his entrepreneurial and marketing methodologies."
author: "梁将军"
publisher: "New Distribution"
email: "zhaobo258@gmail.com"
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published: "2024-01-28"
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# Five Successful Ventures in a Row: The Secret Is Using Product Thinking for Marketing

> Du Guoying, a name unfamiliar to many post-90s and post-00s but known to post-80s, has created products like Back-Back Jia, Haojixing, E-ren E-ben, 8848, and Xiaoguan Tea. In marketing circles, opinions about him are mixed: some despise him for what they see as 'cutting leeks' (exploiting consumers), while others admire his marketing prowess and secretly learn from him. This article explores whether he is a 'leek master' or a 'product manager', and reveals his entrepreneurial and marketing methodologies.

Many post-90s or post-00s may not be familiar with this name, but post-80s certainly are. Let me mention a few products he created, and you'll know: Back-Back Jia, Haojixing, E-ren E-ben, 8848, and Xiaoguan Tea—all founded by Du Guoying. In marketing circles, attitudes toward Du Guoying are particularly contradictory. On one hand, many feel he deserves contempt, thinking he has created so many 'leek-cutting' products, and they don't want to become like him. On the other hand, they are curious how such products sell, thinking he is a marketing master, and secretly learn from him. When we face someone's success, we tend to label them and abstract their success model. For example, online summaries of Du Guoying's success model often follow a three-step formula:
> First, identify a precise need.
>
> Second, find a spokesperson for advertising and product packaging.
>
> Third, use saturation advertising to push the product to the mass market, brainwashing users.
This is the three-step formula for Du Guoying's success. But if you think about it, this formula doesn't hold up. For instance, you say he identifies user pain points accurately. But how can you be sure he isn't hitting imagined pain points, and that he precisely hits real ones? You say he uses advertising to push products, but why is his advertising not a waste of money while yours is? Du Guoying doesn't define himself as a so-called marketing master, nor does he accept being a 'leek master'. He defines himself as a 'product manager'. I think there are many aspects of Du Guoying worth pondering: Is he a 'leek master' or a 'product manager'? What is his entrepreneurial methodology? What is his marketing methodology? Today, we'll uncover this.
**The Key to Breaking Through Is Product Innovation** Before making Back-Back Jia, Du Guoying believed in the power of advertising.
Because before Back-Back Jia, Du Guoying worked as a salesperson at a company in Tianjin. He accidentally invested 2,000 yuan in advertising on Tianjin Radio, and the product sold out. The company's performance tripled because of this move. When did he realize something was wrong? It was when he later failed in entrepreneurship. After leaving the sales company, he made corrective underwear and warm shoes, but these two ventures failed because they were rushed to market without proper testing. Du Guoying said they failed not because of poor marketing but because the products themselves were wrong. In his next venture, he wrote a sentence in his notebook: 'Marketing is technique, product is the way.' Later, he revised it to: **'Product is 1, marketing is 0.'** Du Guoying said that the reason Back-Back Jia succeeded back then was not because marketing was particularly good, but because the product itself had good innovation. Back-Back Jia seems like a simple product today; it uses mechanical principles to correct teenagers' slouching. But it was innovative in many ways. After obtaining the patent for Back-Back Jia, Du Guoying modified the structure and fabric. For example, how to make the fabric more comfortable, and how to make the force applied by the fabric more scientific? Although these were only minor innovations, consumers immediately bought it. Why is getting the product right so important? Because Back-Back Jia is still alive today. Many may not know that Back-Back Jia still generates 200 million yuan in annual online sales, bought by children and young women, with no advertising spend. If the product is right and the need is accurately captured, it can replace advertising and marketing actions, letting the product itself drive sales. Later, when Du Guoying made Haojixing, his product awareness fully awakened. In 2003, a friend showed Du Guoying a product called a word memory machine. What is a word memory machine? Its principle is simple: there is a memory method called the Ebbinghaus forgetting curve, which suggests that seven repetitions create a lifelong memory. This machine reminds students to memorize words based on the memory curve. Du Guoying surveyed the Chinese market and found that most products were not word memory machines or learning machines, but electronic dictionaries. At that time, Du Guoying felt that the purpose of looking up words is to remember them, not just to find them, so he thought the demand for electronic dictionaries was not accurately captured. The future market must be for learning machines, so he made his own learning machine called a word memory machine. When he first entered the consumer electronics industry, he remembered the so-called minor innovations of Back-Back Jia. He said, 'My product must, to some extent, surpass the current state of the industry; it must have its own innovation.' So he made several innovations in this product. First, it initiated the legalization of the educational electronics industry; all content was licensed, which was very advanced. Before Haojixing, most products used pirated content. But Du Guoying realized that if the product grew big, many copyright holders would sue, so legalization was inevitable. He proactively started the legalization of the educational electronics industry. The second bigger innovation was that the word memory machine was synchronized with textbooks, which was very important. Because Chinese children learn English mainly for exams. Synchronization with textbooks meant it was like having an external textbook, and it was very portable. This innovation won a large market. Furthermore, the word memory machine integrated various memory methods, not just Ebbinghaus, catering to different preferences. Finally, the product had the best design; he hired a Korean designer at a high price. Although it was his first time in consumer electronics, he quickly gained deep understanding. He believed that consumer electronics consist of hardware, software, and content; if you do these three well, the product succeeds. Today, we might understand this formula. For example, a phone is hardware, software operating system, and content. But remember, this was before 3G, so such insight was ahead of its time. What is hardware? It refers to whether the design is aesthetically pleasing, comfortable to hold, and easy to use. Software is the operating system; Du Guoying early on thought the OS was important, unlike today where hardware can be copied, but software is technological strength and hard to surpass. Finally, content refers to textbook copyrights and learning methods. These two parts constituted the content of the word memory machine. Hardware, software, and content formed the competitive barrier of Haojixing, and the product eventually sold well.
2 Don't Run Blindly in Others' Advantageous Fields With Haojixing, Du Guoying entered the consumer electronics industry and awakened his dream of being a product manager.
To focus on product development, Du Guoying sold Haojixing and Back-Back Jia to Oak Pacific Interactive. Later, he made the E-ren E-ben product. This project, in his summary, was the least objective of his ventures. Because it was the first time he wanted to make a product for himself. This product was also the one he considered the most failed venture. Why? Because Du Guoying loves learning and writes a lot of notes daily, using about one notebook a week. He thought, using a notebook a week is wasteful and inconvenient. So he wanted to create a digital writing tool for himself, and thus made E-ren E-ben. When E-ren E-ben launched, it coincided with the release of the iPad. Du Guoying thought, 'It's over! This venture will fail.' But he immediately did something: he got Feng Xiaogang and Ge You as spokespersons and launched advertising. He knew the product would fail, so why did he do that? Because he knew a cycle: if a new electronic product launched overseas, it would take about three months to enter the Chinese market and start selling. He estimated he had about three months of advantage to start the market and sell some inventory. If he missed those three months, the product would die completely. So, within those three months, he found good spokespersons, made big investments, and won some market sales in that time gap, preventing the product from dying too miserably. This product actually did slightly better than expected, selling until the third year when it couldn't sell anymore. At that time, almost all IT companies were imitating the iPad, but E-ren E-ben was awkward. First, it wasn't an iPad; it wasn't a computer; it was a digital notebook. And it differed greatly from the iPad; it was closer to the Kindle logic, aiming for an electronic ink screen, better for writing, not a handwriting tablet. This product seemed to fail, but it had significant innovation. The handwriting function of E-ren E-ben had an experience ahead of the industry. He said the difficulty of handwriting is pressure sensitivity. When I write with a pen, does it feel like writing on paper? Even today, Du Guoying says that digital writing still has value. In summary, the reason for E-ren E-ben's failure is that we must always start from user needs. He had a habit of writing a notebook a week, but ordinary people might not use one notebook a year. The public is quite different from oneself, and the need wasn't strong. Du Guoying started consumer electronics earlier than Xiaomi, but E-ren E-ben ended his dream of consumer electronics. He felt he couldn't compete with companies like Apple; he lacked the technical and internet genes, and his existing advantages didn't have the potential for electronics. Although he could see the big trend, he lacked technical sensitivity, so he gave up. The story of E-ren E-ben tells us that entrepreneurship should never run blindly in others' advantageous fields.
**Consumers Vote with Money, Not with Brains** Among all products, the one most considered 'leek-cutting' might be the 8848.
In a market dominated by iPhone, OPPO, and Xiaomi, you make a strange phone, and it still succeeds? People still buy it? Everyone thinks this product is a severe IQ tax, bought by coal bosses. But in Du Guoying's view, this product had rigorous market demand exploration and thinking. How did this demand judgment come about? Once, a friend of a friend complained and asked if he could recommend a good phone brand, saying his aunt's iPhone version was newer than his. Du Guoying felt this might be a market. Because there was no high-end phone model to match the status symbol of the wealthy, but there was in cars and home appliances. A frequently used electronic product like a phone had none? The most expensive iPhone, ordinary people could afford with some effort. He entered the market and found that one phone brand globally targeted the high-end: Vertu from the UK. He looked at Vertu's market positioning and thought it had problems. Because Vertu sold overseas, converted to RMB, a phone might cost 100,000 to 200,000 yuan, very expensive, a heavy luxury product. But Vertu's software, system R&D, and tech capabilities were far behind Apple. Many bosses who bought Vertu found it became a brick after two years, but since they spent so much, they were reluctant to discard it, an awkward situation. So Du Guoying judged that the market could be tapped, but not with heavy luxury phones; it must be light luxury. A light luxury phone means it's more expensive than an iPhone but not too much. At that time, the iPhone was about 5,000 yuan, so he positioned the 8848 at 10,000 yuan. He said, 'About double the premium. I think Chinese bosses and wealthy people can accept it, and it fits their status.' The 8848 also innovated for its high-end business positioning. First, in form, it emphasized luxury with titanium alloy and genuine leather, looking luxurious. Then, in software, it focused on security and dual systems, hitting the security point accurately. Because bosses have many company secrets; if the phone is lost, it could have a big impact on them and their company, so security is crucial. Also, some Chinese bosses might have messy relationships, which might be another reason the product sold well. The spokesperson for the 8848 was also well chosen: Wang Shi. At that time, few in the Chinese market used entrepreneurs as spokespersons. Wang Shi represented the image of an educated, wealthy, and influential entrepreneur. After Wang Shi endorsed the 8848, many online mocked him, thinking he helped cut leeks. But this might be a stigmatized perception of the 8848. From a product positioning perspective, the 8848 was a very successful product. Because consumers vote with money, not brains; as long as people buy it and it's validated in the market, they are willing to pay, proving the product meets their expectations. Even if the 8848 cuts leeks, it cuts the leeks of the wealthy. For the so-called wealthy, it's just a small amount. The product launched around 2015, and by 2016, Du Guoying left the team. He felt the team, product, and market structure were mature, so he left because he wanted to make Xiaoguan Tea.
**The Ultimate of Marketing Is the Output of Values** When making Xiaoguan Tea, Du Guoying suddenly had this awareness: 'Product is not the most important; values are the most important.'
Previously, he thought product is 1, marketing is 0. Now he thinks that in front of values, everything is 0. Why does 'marketing ultimately is values' come about? I think it doesn't come from him but from his idol, Steve Jobs. The idea that marketing ultimately is values comes from a speech Jobs gave in 1997. Let me repeat the original words: 'Marketing is about values. This is a very complicated world, a very noisy world, and we're not going to get a chance to get people to remember much about us. No company will. We have to be very clear on what we want them to know about us. To restore Apple's influence, it's not about product features and prices, not about how many hertz the computer has, not about why we're better than Windows. In all marketing cases, the best is Nike. Nike sells shoes, but when you think of Nike, you feel something different from a shoe company. In their ads, they never talk about the air cushion. They always pay tribute to great athletes.' This is part of Jobs' 1997 speech.
Jobs explained why he thought the ultimate of marketing is values. Apple indeed does this. What is Apple's slogan? It's 'Think Different.' What is its philosophy? It's changing the world. Nike, which Jobs admired, also does this. What does Nike talk about? It talks about 'Just Do It,' the idea of bravely doing it, taking action immediately. In all Nike ads, they never talk about the technology or features, but it is indeed a shoe company. Why, after so many ventures, did Du Guoying finally realize that Jobs' words were correct? Because after selling several companies, he found he was always doing 'from 0 to 1.' But many companies that started with him had already gone 'from 10 to 100.' For example, Nongfu Spring has sold just water for many years, but Zhong Shanshan has become China's richest man. He believes entrepreneurship should pursue 'thick snow and long slopes.' You should find a long track, wet snow, and keep rolling, making the company as big as possible, rather than repeatedly doing 'from 0 to 1.' Many diversified companies that want to earn all kinds of money eventually fail. For example, Xu Jiayin's Evergrande finally failed in recent years, though it was brilliant early on. Feng Lun once said in an interview, and I strongly agree: 'Over the years, I think the three key words for entrepreneurship are simplicity, focus, and persistence.' Feng Lun used Nongfu Spring and Evergrande as examples. He believed that if you are simple enough, focus on one thing, and persist for many years, you will definitely get a big result. If you want to earn all kinds of money, you won't win the best result in this market. After reaching this conclusion, Du Guoying's entrepreneurial behavior changed. Previously, he would retreat when hitting a ceiling; you see he sold his previous companies. Now he says he won't. After founding Xiaoguan Tea, he mainly experienced two major setbacks. The first was in 2012, the fourth year of founding Xiaoguan Tea. After four years, he hadn't created a product or launched it to market. He spent those four years researching the market and preparing, a very long cycle, costing about 70 million yuan. Think about it: four years of entrepreneurship, spending 70 million, and no product emerged. For many entrepreneurs, this would be the point to give up. But Du Guoying said, 'I never thought about giving up; I felt this could be done continuously.' So although he spent almost every weekend at the tea plantation, burning money daily, he firmly believed this path would work; he just hadn't gotten it right yet. Finally, after four years, he found a way and made it work. The second major setback was in 2019. Xiaoguan Tea launched in 2016, and by 2018, sales reached 2 billion yuan. But in 2019, when he wanted to accelerate growth, he was suddenly attacked online. Many articles dug up his history, saying many of his products were 'leek-cutting' and that he was a 'leek master.' This wave of attacks caused Xiaoguan Tea's sales to plummet. Then came the mask period, and it wasn't until 2021 that sales recovered to peak levels. He endured the cyberbullying and the pandemic. He said, 'I also think I must persist; I will do this until I die.' This is the charm of values. Only with firm values can we make firm life and entrepreneurial choices without wavering due to short-term interests. How did Du Guoying achieve this cognitive iteration from marketing, product, to values? Du Guoying believes that to improve cognitive iteration, there are only three opportunities: major setbacks, meeting experts, and reading classics. He has experienced major setbacks. As for meeting experts, we don't know who he talked to. As for reading classics, Du Guoying mentioned that his learning of brand marketing and product was mostly self-taught. Especially for brand marketing, in 1995-96, China's advertising and brand marketing markets were underdeveloped, with few resources. He mainly read classics like 'Positioning' and books by Kotler. He also subscribed to industry magazines like 'Sales and Marketing.' By the way, this magazine is an important journal in the industry. Even in the digital media era, it still thrives. The editor-in-chief of Sales and Marketing is also a member of our intensive reading club. Often, encountering major setbacks isn't something we can casually meet, and we don't want to casually meet them. So, major setbacks are experiences in life, not something to pursue. Meeting experts depends on life's circumstances; whether you can meet experts and whether they can teach you isn't under your control. Only one thing is under your control: reading classics. Our intensive reading club has always recommended timeless, classic information, essentially to let everyone dialogue with experts. Today, studying Du Guoying's entrepreneurial ideas, business concepts, and marketing methodologies is a dialogue with him.
**Final Words** Du Guoying's three cognitive iterations in brand marketing are marketing, product, and values.
Everyone should remember two sentences: **Product is 1, marketing is 0.** This is completely contrary to the external view of Du Guoying's success. Du Guoying considers himself a product manager; his success lies in getting the product right, not in being a marketing master.
**The ultimate of marketing is values.** This is his current deepest understanding of marketing. Because he believes that for a company to achieve long-term results, it must have its own values to withstand short-term temptations and fluctuations.
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